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Submitted by phani on December 10, 2005 - 2:40pm.

Some time ago Kaunteya prabhu sent me an article from CIO Insight, an online-magazine offering "Strategies for IT Business Leaders". I quickly glanced over the article and wrote back, saying I didn't think it was particularly relevant to our mission.

In the beginning the author elaborates on the use of fancy high-tech gadgets by mega-churches, christian community-churches that attract an audience of more than 2,000 per week, to produce sermons that remind you of the presentation of rap-, pop-, or rock-superstars, depending on your age.

I don't like all that show-biz and think that if you took away the glamour from these mega-churches, there would remain very little of substance. But reading Sita-pati prabhu's article on the subject, and some of his earlier, related writings, I started to think again.

I'm still not comfortable with too much show and glamour, but nobody suggested we copy their whole act, down to emotional performances instead of the presentation of a supreme philosophy and authentic kirtan and bhajan.

There are some lessons we can and should learn from these mega-churches who seem to develop faster today than ISKCON at its peak. They themselves say that their rapid progress is due mainly to the use of modern technology; not only to produce professional stage performances, but to track and manage their churches and congregation.

ISKCON isn't all that famous for being superbly organized or able to use the latest technology (or even the second- or third-latest) for anything but typing up reports and designing invitations for the next sunday feast on isolated desktop-PCs, including those concerned with congregational development and the Bhakti-vriksha program, which should have the potential to grow as fast - at least - as those mega-churches do. Sita-pati prabhu says in his above mentioned, recent article:

" Now in practice what happens is that coordinating the movement of paper is practically impossible, even at the local level. For the group leaders to fill out a report is sometimes too much to ask. Getting it from them takes more time. By the time you get everyone's reports, it's already the next week, and you spent so much time and energy just getting them that you don't have time to do anything with the data.

Unless you have a secretary you now have to sit down and enter all that data into a spreadsheet to get it in a useable form. God help you if your Bhakti-vriksha is actually successful, because you'll be swamped under the paperwork.

What happens in practice, in my experience, is that reporting is simply discarded as too much trouble. The lack of reports coming out of the ministry tend to support my supposition that this is a widespread phenomenon.

I don't have to keep harping on the point, but I am. A lot of the systems involved in Bhakti-vriksha currently just can't scale to support the kind of growth that it is potentially capable of. It's a system that is currently destined to fail because success will kill it. It is self-limiting.

Here's an idea for a solution:

First the caveat: this will only work initially in developed countries, but if you build it, they will come…

There is an online system where the group leader, after the meeting, the next day, whatever, logs in and fills out the report online.

Bada bing .

Now the area commander does not have to deal with massive amounts of paperwork, and neither does the group leader. The area commander doesn't have to chase all the group leaders, and they don't have to add finding the area commander to hand in their paper work to their duties of maintaining contact with their group members.

The area commander doesn't have to convert the data from paper to electronic form, and as you get more groups and group leaders, the work automatically redistributes. Ladies and Gentlemen, can you say "Scalability".

Now here's the kicker. You use one central database, and the namahatta.org heads can run global reports on it.

That's what I thought when I saw what happens when the theory of the BV Manual (on reporting) meets the real world.

Now we just need to build an IT capability to build and maintain such a solution, and we'll be there. More on that in the next post. "

Here at namahatta.org we have at least part of the infrastructure in place to start development on those lines. Through our web server we are able to reach pretty much every corner of the world, and to implement a simple database application that's able to keep track of reports submitted by local groups isn't a problem either. I'm not a DB-expert and what I start to develop now will have to be streamlined and upgraded later on, but again: no problem. The know-how and technology is available, it just takes a little effort and vision to go into the right direction, I believe.

Thanks a lot to Sita-pati prabhu for shaking me awake in this regard, and if you don't see any development in this direction very soon, I would appreciate if someone could get into my case, or better perhaps, replace me in my job.

Your servant, phanisvara das.

 

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mega-churches

Sati-pati Prabhu: This is all very interesting but as I was saying years ago and today as well, the idea is to not have 40,000 attend a big preaching event like this although it has possibilities for the future and is somewhat reminiscent of the earlky ISKCON days (on a smaller level) when Srila Prabhupada's early and eager disciples rented auditoriums etc. there are many things to take into consideration.

First of all, the main attraction in the early days was Srila Prabhupada himself and everything else followed from that. There was preaching and even rock concerts etc.

Be that as it may, my vision, as I formed The Vedic Theatre Company specifically with the "maga-church" idea in mind although not on such a vast scale, was instead, attract the masses to dramas, stage plays and in that way present Krsna consciousness in an emotional and kinetic manner while still retaining the bhakti and which will, hopefully, lead the audience to imbibe Srila Prabhupada's books.

In this regard, my idea for a "Vedic dinner theatre" has gone unanswered. At the same time, I have 2-3 never-before-seen stage plays that are very professional that would make for a great theatrical event, say, performing the plays several times a week just as karmi plays are presented. This concept would be a great boon to book distributors as well. Buy a book, have dinner and see a play for a low price concept.

However, even at a grass roots level, to produce a play and have a venue, (if it is not just a "temple skit") also requires money but certainly much, much less than the "mega-church" concept as described in this recent post.

If you know of any devotees that would be enthusiastic about this theatrical approach, have them contact me at: vedictheatre@aol.com

To get some info on my two plays go to:

http://www.playsthething.homestead.com/mahawomen.html

http://www.playsthething.homestead.com/vyasa.html

http://www.playsthething.homestead.com/krishna.html

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sorry if i butt in here ...

... but i think you should have posted this comment on sita-pati's web site rather than here.

sita-pati pr. didn't write this article, i did. i quoted an article of his, but i am not sure that he will even read your comment on this site.

and in this article i don't write so much about attracting huge crowds. the bhakti-vriksha program is all about small groups with close relationships among the members, and the idea to spread into many more such small groups rapidly.

this will not necessarily lead to mega-events with tens of thousands attending, but to a huge number of small groups that is very difficult to keep track of without modern technology.

what you say about dinner-theater performances may very well lead to more people becoming attracted to krishna consciousness, and therefore joining big temples or small bhakti-vriksha groups, or it might be a form of preaching performed by one or several of such small groups. but it isn't directly related to congregational preaching, it's another form of preaching. that's why we did not follow up very much on your theater-idea here on namahatta.org.

nevertheless, thank you for your comment on my article, since it gives me an opportunity to explain the idea once again.

ys phani.

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Every mega-church was once a mini-church

I also had a lot of preconceptions and assumptions about megachurches, and Christian preaching in general. I then read the literature produced by some of the leaders of these churches, such as Rick Warren, Bill Hybels, and Andy Stanley.

It is solid stuff, deep - not superficial, and as they make the point, they didn't start out as mega-churches. These churches started through doing the hard yards, with a few dedicated visionary leaders who committed to the cause. These people are deeply committed preachers who have sacrificed over a long time.

Another point is that in order to not collapse under their own weight, these churches have cellular structures, called Community Groups, Small Groups or other similar names. As Andy Stanley says: "You have to grow small as you grow big".

Great site btw phani.

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the bigger they are the harder they fall?

In a previous job, I had a role of studying religious groups, churches, cults, self-help orgs, and the like. What I saw, and this is clearly my own perception, is that the larger the mega-church organization was, the further away from the core of their religion they had become.

The larger the organization, the more scrutiny, and the higher public expectations as well. One leader of such a group commits even the smallest offense, and the entire group is blamed. (remember PTL). The millions of dollars and immeasurable amount of human resources they spend on building up these showplace media-meccas become wasted.

Even in our Hare Krsna movement, the perception of devotees being corrupt was widespread due to the actions of what amount to fraction of a fraction of a percentage of memebrs doing wrong.

His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada, however, liked big Krsna preaching. Any way to get the Holy Names onto the lips of people throughout the world. But his method was simple. Harinama-Sankirtan, Book Distribution, Prasadam Distribution. By his example, simply going to the streets and chanting, he was able to change a million people into a million Vaishnava devotees. And following that example has always been successful. Even now, we see that where harinama-sankirtana is going on, people come to the temples. And just as in Srila Prabhupada's example, as he presented his message, the doors became open.

janardana-dasa (john n)
chicagoland, usa
please accept my humble obeisances...

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Srila Prabhupada:

"One who has got a helpful wife at home does not require to accept sannyas. We are concerned more for Krishna Consciousness & if that work is executed more nicely by cooperation of husband & wife, there is no necessity of thinking wife as impediment."

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